[tei-council] <quotation>

[Lou Burnard]

On 11/12/12 11:38, Sebastian Rahtz wrote:
>
> On 11 Dec 2012, at 10:36, Lou Burnard <lou.burnard at retired.ox.ac.uk>
>   wrote:
>>
>> By all means lets have a discussion about the usefulness of <defaultVal>
>>
> we have 83 of them, so its not a trivial issue to resolve

Yes. I suggest we put it on the council agenda though.

...


> The encoder of a text chooses to encode what is significant to them. They may not ever intend the text to be rendered, and they may not care tuppence what happens when your stylesheet hits it!
>>
> That's burying your head in the sand. No-one encodes a text in TEI XML without expecting someone sometime to do _some_ processing
> on it, in the vaguest sense. whether it is my stylesheets or  whatever tool, there must be a processing model of this stuff.

We are in a bad temper today aren't we? All I'm saying is that the 
processing model anticipated by the encoder may not have much or 
anything to do with realising the text in a nice HTML-like form. They 
may just want to count the words or align the transcription with an 
audio, or who knows what.

>
>>> I did take the liberty of removing the one I found in <said>. If people
>>> think that was bad, I'll restore them.
>>
>> I think they should be restored but *inside* the element, for consistency with the other <said> examples, where you have mdashes retained inside the element.
>
> those French examples with mdashes are anomalous, as most of the examples of <said> have omitted
> the quote marks or whatever.  I'd argue they should have a <quotation marks="all"> as part of the example,
> to show readers how to get the meaning they want.

"anomalous" does not mean "inconsistent with what I would do". If we 
restore the ones you removed, then we'd have three examples with 
preserved quotes and seven without, which seems about right to me, 
especially since the text explicitly says you can choose between leaving 
quotes in and not doing so. You might for instance want to determine how 
many of your <said>s use the mdash convention, and how many use others.

I quote:

"Quotation marks themselves may, like other punctuation marks, be felt 
for some purposes to be worth retaining within a text, quite 
independently of their description by the rend attribute."

>
> Shall I get started now on  the confusion for the reader by showing them
> both
> 	rend="PRE+lsquo POST+rsquo"
> and
> 	rend="pre(“) post(”)
> or shall I leave that for another day or another lifetime?

I wanted to replace all that rendition laddering, but my courage failed 
me at the last moment. Syd, since you're now on this list, would you 
care to express an opinion about whether we should replace all these 
examples with a CSS formulation?