[tei-council] list types and rends: bug 460

[Martin Holmes]

On 13-12-22 09:44 AM, Sebastian Rahtz wrote:
>
> On 22 Dec 2013, at 15:19, Martin Holmes <mholmes at uvic.ca> wrote:
>
>> On the point that the rest of the world uses the "ordered" vs
>> "unordered" distinction, outside of HTML (which I think got this
>> wrong, although the decision was made before CSS existed), what
>> other standards use those terms? XSL:FO doesn't (it relies on
>> fo:list-item-label, which can be a bullet or a number). ODF (on
>> which I'm no expert, so correct me if I'm wrong) uses
>> text:list-level-style-number> alongside
>> text:list-level-style-bullet>
>
> true. Docbook is the one I was thinking of apart from HTML. I see it
> uses “itemised” and “ordered”. they also use “simple” for "An
> undecorated list of single words or short phrases”

That's an odd combination of rendering-description and 
content-restriction. I don't see why you couldn't have a simple list 
with long items. But DocBook is on firmer ground here because it's 
closely coupled with a processing model.

>
>> On balance, I still prefer "numbered", but another possibility
>> would be "enumerated" -- is that actually different, and if it is,
>> would it be better?
>>
> no, leave as “numbered”; “enumerated” will just cause argument.
>
> Docbook has a nice description: "orderedlist — A list in which each
> entry is marked with a sequentially incremented label”

Oooh, lovely. I wonder if we can borrow that.

>
>> I'm going to turn this into a formal proposal on the wiki; it's
>> obviously not going into the next release, because the stylesheets
>> obviously have to be ready at the same time as the Glines changes.
>>
> thats OK, if we agreed on it far enough in advance. it would only be
> a few hours work.

If the changes to Stylesheets are only additions, they can be done at 
any time. In fact, a good approach would be to do the Stylesheets 
changes first, then use the changes to Guidelines usage as one of the 
checks on Stylesheet functionality.

> if you’re working on it in bored moments between the sprouts and the
> pudding, having a test/example file would be be no bad thing, showing
> all the possibilities.

That's a really good idea. Will do. I'll put that in the wiki page too, 
so people can suggest more examples if they think of them.

>> On the question of handling old values in the Stylesheets, I think
>> we have to, at least for a while; people will scream instantly if
>> @type values we've been recommending for many years suddenly don't
>> work properly with a new release of the Stylesheets. This brings up
>> the possibility of deprecation in the Stylesheets, of course.
>
> yes. i don’t know where to start, though, in implementing this…. --

Or we could think of this as a P6 thing. Perhaps in P6 everything comes 
with a default processing model, which the stylesheets just implement, 
and deprecation in the source is coupled with deprecation in the 
Stylesheets.

It's nice to dream of P6. Actually, our suggestion for a TEI Journal 
edition on "Imagining P6" has gone down well with the editors.

Cheers,
Martin

> Sebastian Rahtz Director (Research) of Academic IT University of
> Oxford IT Services 13 Banbury Road, Oxford OX2 6NN. Phone +44 1865
> 283431
>