Re: [sixties-l] teeny tiny protests on Sproul Step

From: William M Mandel (
Date: 10/09/00

  • Next message: radman: "[sixties-l] Horowitz on Horowitz"

    Simply to add to Jeff's statement because I am old enough to remember an earlier
    period. Before Hitler, while Zionism most certainly existed among American Jews,
    it was a minor trend. Nor were religious differences a big deal. By an large,
    East European Jews here were Orthodox or, among the more educated, Conservative.
    Jews of German origin were of the Reform denomination. Of course, there were
    exceptions in all these categories.
        The biggest disagreement, particularly among working people, who were the
    majority of the Jewish population, was whether you were Socialist or Communist or
    voted for a major party.
                                                            Bill Mandel
    Jeffrey Blankfort wrote:
    > John, your statement that those who oppose a Jewish state are
    > anti-semitic is simply one more example of your capitulation to
    > pro-Israel propaganda which equates anti-Zionmism with anti-semitism.
    > This is simply not only historically not true, but is sheer nonsense.
    > Until World War, the belief, among Jews, that Jews should have a country
    > of their own, was largely marginal. An extimated 95% of European Jews
    > did not conisder themselves Zionist and had no intention or desire to
    > emigrate to Israel even when it seemed that their life might depend on
    > it. Thise who wanted to go elsewhere found there plans opposed by the
    > Zionists. David Ben Gurion wrote in 1938, that "if the do-gooders among
    > non-Jews and the anti-ZionistJews have their way and Jews are allowed to
    > go anywhere but Palestine, the dream of Zionism will be dead," and
    > consequently the Zionists refused to participate in any rescue operation
    > for European Jewry that had any other destination than Palestine.
    > Even among those Jews who did emigrate to Palestine there were those who
    > did not believe in a Jewish state but preferred a bi-national state,
    > that is, Arab and Jewish, and today there are a number of Israelis whom
    > I met while there who consider themselves anti-Zionist, and would prefer
    > a democratic secular state, even though the possibility of achieving
    > that end seems more remote today than ever.
    > As for Palestians, at least 750,000 of whom were dispossessed to make
    > room for the state of Israel, to expect them and their children and
    > grandchildren to recognize the legitimacy of that dispossession and if
    > not to consider them anti-semitic, is simply outrageous. John, this is
    > clearly a subject you know next to nothing about. To get a better
    > perspective, I would recommend two books to you that were best sellers
    > in Israel (so they are not PLO propganda) and are available here. They
    > are both by the same author, Tom Segev, an Israeli journalist. One is
    > "1948:the First Israelis," and the other is the "The 7th Million." Also
    > "Perfidy," by Ben Hecht, which deals with the betrayal of the European
    > Jews by the mainstream Zionist movement. It has been reissued in
    > paperback. Let me conclude, as a Jew, that if the Zionists had not
    > harmed a single hair of a Palestinian or Lebanese, and had not taken a
    > single inch of their land, I would never forgive them for placing the
    > building of a Jewish state ahead of saving the Jews of Europe, who  were
    > a far better lot.
    > Jeff Blankfort
    >    > Date: Fri, 06 Oct 2000 19:29:48 -0700
    > > From: John Johnson <>
    > > Subject: Re: [sixties-l] teeny tiny protests on Sproul Steps
    > >
    > > If there wasn't a link there is now.  Should Jews have their own country
    > > would be answered yes by all but the most anti-Semitic.
    > >
    > > There has been a long standing position in the opposition that Israel
    > > should not exist at all, for some real reasons but that position will never
    > > be viable.  There is also a long standing religious aspect to the
    > > conflict.  Just as their is around the world today.  Of course most to do
    > > not exist in isolation, there are usually  overlaying political and
    > > economics behind such conflicts, but the religious ones add fuel and
    > > divisions.
    > >

    This archive was generated by hypermail 2b30 : 10/09/00 EDT