William M. Mandel wrote: Jerry: The point is that Stew and you have different definitions of socialism. I think Stew understands it in the classical sense of an end to private ownership of the means of production. You understand it as any reforms that take the sharp edges off capitalism. JW reply: Could be. I understand it as any enterprise or service, including the means of production, that is democratically controlled either indirectly through a democratic level of government or directly through worker owned cooperatives (more or less, but you should get the point, and since this is theoretical I do not want to argue about the influence of money or the media over the control of democratic governments). I also agree with Stew that the outcome of socialist enterprise is to serve the needs of the community (a statement which itself could generate pages of discussion). I would disagree with Stew that Santa Rita is not a socialist institution since it is a child of a theoretically democratic government and is designed to serve the needs of society. The fact that it does not serve those needs in a way that we see fit and is used from time to time against socialists is lamentable. Where I live we have the means of electricity production and delivery owned by the state. That is a form of socialism and among our benefits is the third lowest electric rates in North America, way lower than the mess in California. Another form of socialism here is that the state owns the only insurance company authorized to sell basic auto insurance, it also registers vehicles for the state. My rates are better here than they were when I lived in California. We also have a state owned major railway and there are many more examples and that is why I rose to the bait to point out that socialism was not defeated. Anyone who feels a desire to live in a place where democratic socialism can actually achieve power peacefully and implement some of its principles should move on up to BC, we can use more good voters to fend off the free enterprise pirates and corporadoes. :) -- Jerry West Editor/publisher/janitor ---------------------------------------------------- THE RECORD News and Views from Nootka Sound & Canada's West Coast An independent, progressive regional publication http://www.island.net/~record/
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